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animaion
Post  Post subject: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:14 pm

Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:12 pm
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Do you plan:
- OSX OpenGL biased renderer
- OSX OpenCL version for raytracing
for Furryball5?

Thanks.


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Jan_Tomanek
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:04 pm
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FurryBall 5 will be CUDA (NVIDIA) only.
It will open FurryBall for OSX and LINUX and make it MUCH faster in interactivity.

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mhdmhd
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 5:38 pm
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Is this means that you will not update the rasterize part of furryball and it will be a raytracer only ?


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Jan_Tomanek
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 7:22 am
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There is probably 2 options:
1) Split FurryBall into two versions (Rasterize and Trace), but we are almost on limits what rasterize can do. What more you will need to add or update into rasterize???
2) Raytrace (mean primary rays, not indirect rays) will be fast as Rasterize and there will be NO need for Rasterize anymore even for Cartoon effect, etc.

What do you think? We will love to open the discussion.

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mhdmhd
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2014 11:50 pm
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"Raytrace (mean primary rays, not indirect rays) will be fast as Rasterize " :o

That I have hard time believing it ,on the other hand raterizer is very very fast and it is suitable for productions that can not afford time costly raytracer for example tv animation productions.

you could make the rasterize more user friendly like I wrote in some other post here you could make the gi and reflection and refraction part more fast and higher quality in its own game-like way not comparable to raytracer , sometimes I render something in v ray and it look realistic but in a rasterizer or in a game engine it has another stylish look to it out of the box.

you could use opengl I heard that it is faster than directx.

also I think furryball(rasterize which I care about) in 3ds max are not behaving as expected also sometimes in maya but not as much as 3ds max ,furryball integration in 3ds max needs alot of attention.

I talk about the rasterizer and frankly all I care about is rendering a 1080HD frame of descent quality with little gi and little reflection,some character animation and some fx in one to three minutes :)


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animaion
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 12:08 pm

Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:12 pm
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Rasterize renderer is very fast but there are annoying limitations and bugs in rasterize method. So if you can make HQ image raytrace renderer as fast as rasterize it would be awesome.

Regarding OSX version. I am very interested but I wonder who will use CUDA renderer on Mac. Some Old Mac Pro guys? They will switch to PC or nMP soon. Macbook, iMac users? Not suitable for serious 3D work. Apple chose a OpenCL. CUDA for them is non existent - quite similar story as with Flash.
I’ve heard that there are problems with OpenCL and AMD drivers (e.g. Blender) and writing for CUDA is simpler than for OpenCL but possibly maybe OpenCL is a future and CUDA is already living dead.

I am using PC with Nvidia cards (for me Furryball is the only reason to use Windows and buy PC workstation), oMP with Nvidia cards and MacBook with Nvidia card. I try to think pragmatically.

Thanks


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Jan_Tomanek
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 1:23 pm
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OK... so...
1) Easy to use is NOT possible with Rasterize. In Raytrace you need "just" send ray, but for rasterize all effects (reflection, refraction, indirect...) are faked and ALL has to be made per object... so it need MANY and MANY setups. This is reason, why is Rasterize part in FurryBall so complicated.

Very complicated rasterize effects, we had in FurryBall 4, was now even SLOWER than real raytraced reflections.
More in this talk:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsqPBS9 ... e=youtu.be

2) Open GL is NOT faster than DirectX and it has not same features (today almost same, but not before 5 years we select DX).

We hope Raytrace version will be really fast even for primary rays, and much LESS memory consumable.

Only slow is pathtraced indirect, but we have in plan some special FAKE raytrace indirect - 10x faster than today raytrace indirect.

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Jan_Tomanek
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 1:25 pm
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We also hope, that MAC will open again for NVIDIA cards, because now it's a TRAGEDY. The latest Mac Pro is more toy than PRO workstation.... ;-(

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animaion
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:43 pm

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Jan_Tomanek wrote:
We also hope, that MAC will open again for NVIDIA cards, because now it's a TRAGEDY. The latest Mac Pro is more toy than PRO workstation.... ;-(



Apple will not open for CUDA. They made decision to help to kill CUDA. I think it can be right decision in few years perspective.

More and more "pro" companies writing in OpenCL (or both OpenCL/CUDA) so I would be careful in calling new MacPro a "toy". For example, let's take a hypothetical situation that we have a several external Thunderbolt OpenCL "accelerators" (based on fast GPU processors) plugged to nMP. This would change picture of nMP a little. For now it is great tool for FCPX/Motion etc.

Best regards


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TijuanaKez
Post  Post subject: Re: Furryball 5 OSX  |  Posted: Sun Nov 08, 2015 5:28 am

Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2015 5:11 am
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Hey guys, I've been quietly peaking in at this project from time to time and I'm very interested the potential this has for my workflow.
I do mainly motion graphics and compositing stuff for music videos and I don't need photorealistic renders, but I do need speed!

I was really hoping you had migrated to openCL by now as after many years fighting with, fixing, tweaking and anti-malwaring various windows machines, I simply loath windows and can no longer bare it.

I'd like to let you know that myself and 4 other professionals I know personally are all runnings specced up hackintoshes with nVidia cards and latest mac CUDA drivers are working great with Adobe software and various after effects plugins, as well as Blender's Cycle renderer.

There is a lot of desire for a Mac version of furry ball amongst us so please consider it for a future release.

You will of course alienate a lot of real mac users with AMD cards if you stick with CUDA though so I suggest have your dev team have a little play with this http://gpgpu.org/2010/03/09/swan.

Cheers.


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